Skip to content
  • MySensors
  • OpenHardware.io
  • Categories
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
Skins
  • Light
  • Brite
  • Cerulean
  • Cosmo
  • Flatly
  • Journal
  • Litera
  • Lumen
  • Lux
  • Materia
  • Minty
  • Morph
  • Pulse
  • Sandstone
  • Simplex
  • Sketchy
  • Spacelab
  • United
  • Yeti
  • Zephyr
  • Dark
  • Cyborg
  • Darkly
  • Quartz
  • Slate
  • Solar
  • Superhero
  • Vapor

  • Default (No Skin)
  • No Skin
Collapse
Brand Logo
  1. Home
  2. Development
  3. [security] Introducing signing support to MySensors

[security] Introducing signing support to MySensors

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Development
security
491 Posts 48 Posters 333.9k Views 30 Watching
  • Oldest to Newest
  • Newest to Oldest
  • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • AnticimexA Offline
    AnticimexA Offline
    Anticimex
    Contest Winner
    wrote on last edited by
    #229

    And on development branch, @tekka has an open PR where he has cut down significantly on the size of the NRF24 driver as well.

    Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • AnticimexA Offline
      AnticimexA Offline
      Anticimex
      Contest Winner
      wrote on last edited by
      #230

      And you might also have read mine and @mfalkvidd's stand on encryption, so don't be discouraged if you find that you can't fit both. Just skip the encryption in that case. It adds far less in security than signing does.

      Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • SoloamS Offline
        SoloamS Offline
        Soloam
        Hardware Contributor
        wrote on last edited by
        #231

        Yes, if I have to discard one it would be encryption! Thank you for the help @Anticimex and @mfalkvidd

        1 Reply Last reply
        1
        • carlierdC Offline
          carlierdC Offline
          carlierd
          wrote on last edited by
          #232

          Hello,

          I currently testing various bootloader to measure impact on CPU speed on the power consumption.
          I got a lot of nonce error when using 1 MHz configuration.

          Is signing feature possible at 1 MHz ?

          Thanks.

          David.

          AnticimexA 1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • carlierdC carlierd

            Hello,

            I currently testing various bootloader to measure impact on CPU speed on the power consumption.
            I got a lot of nonce error when using 1 MHz configuration.

            Is signing feature possible at 1 MHz ?

            Thanks.

            David.

            AnticimexA Offline
            AnticimexA Offline
            Anticimex
            Contest Winner
            wrote on last edited by
            #233

            @carlierd could you specify a bit clearer what you mean by "nonce error"? Signing should work, but the atsha driver is not tested @ 1MHz and might get bad timing. Also, for soft (and hard) signing, if 1MHz is used, performance could degrade to the point that the nonce timeout needs to be increased.

            Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

            carlierdC 1 Reply Last reply
            1
            • AnticimexA Anticimex

              @carlierd could you specify a bit clearer what you mean by "nonce error"? Signing should work, but the atsha driver is not tested @ 1MHz and might get bad timing. Also, for soft (and hard) signing, if 1MHz is used, performance could degrade to the point that the nonce timeout needs to be increased.

              carlierdC Offline
              carlierdC Offline
              carlierd
              wrote on last edited by
              #234

              @Anticimex

              Hello.

              I am using soft signing.

              find parent
              send: 255-255-255-255 s=255,c=3,t=7,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=bc:
              read: 255-255-255 s=255,c=3,t=7,pt=0,l=0,sg=0:
              sensor started, id=255, parent=255, distance=255
              find parent
              send: 255-255-255-255 s=255,c=3,t=7,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=bc:
              read: 0-0-255 s=255,c=3,t=8,pt=1,l=1,sg=0:0
              parent=0, d=1
              read: 0-0-255 s=255,c=3,t=8,pt=1,l=1,sg=0:0
              req id
              send: 255-255-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=3,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=ok:
              read: 0-0-255 s=255,c=3,t=4,pt=0,l=1,sg=0:9
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=15,pt=2,l=2,sg=0,st=fail:1
              read and drop: 9-9-0 s=255,c=3,t=15,pt=2,l=2,sg=0:1
              read: 0-0-9 s=255,c=3,t=15,pt=2,l=2,sg=0:1
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
              nonce tr err
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
              nonce tr err
              read and drop: 9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=6,pt=1,l=1,sg=0:0
              read: 0-0-9 s=255,c=3,t=17,pt=6,l=25,sg=0:0129D04B64916F5E805EFDF704C34F56B47E547FDDE93805BE
              id=9
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=0,c=0,t=0,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=ok:
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=1,c=0,t=30,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
              [Setup duration: 9928 ms]
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=0,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
              nonce tr err
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=1,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
              nonce tr err
              send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
              nonce tr err
              Value is 1   Cycle is 1   3.39 v   [753 ms]
              

              Thanks,

              David.

              AnticimexA 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • carlierdC carlierd

                @Anticimex

                Hello.

                I am using soft signing.

                find parent
                send: 255-255-255-255 s=255,c=3,t=7,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=bc:
                read: 255-255-255 s=255,c=3,t=7,pt=0,l=0,sg=0:
                sensor started, id=255, parent=255, distance=255
                find parent
                send: 255-255-255-255 s=255,c=3,t=7,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=bc:
                read: 0-0-255 s=255,c=3,t=8,pt=1,l=1,sg=0:0
                parent=0, d=1
                read: 0-0-255 s=255,c=3,t=8,pt=1,l=1,sg=0:0
                req id
                send: 255-255-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=3,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=ok:
                read: 0-0-255 s=255,c=3,t=4,pt=0,l=1,sg=0:9
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=15,pt=2,l=2,sg=0,st=fail:1
                read and drop: 9-9-0 s=255,c=3,t=15,pt=2,l=2,sg=0:1
                read: 0-0-9 s=255,c=3,t=15,pt=2,l=2,sg=0:1
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
                nonce tr err
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
                nonce tr err
                read and drop: 9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=6,pt=1,l=1,sg=0:0
                read: 0-0-9 s=255,c=3,t=17,pt=6,l=25,sg=0:0129D04B64916F5E805EFDF704C34F56B47E547FDDE93805BE
                id=9
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=0,c=0,t=0,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=ok:
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=1,c=0,t=30,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
                [Setup duration: 9928 ms]
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=0,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
                nonce tr err
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=1,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
                nonce tr err
                send: 9-9-0-0 s=255,c=3,t=16,pt=0,l=0,sg=0,st=fail:
                nonce tr err
                Value is 1   Cycle is 1   3.39 v   [753 ms]
                

                Thanks,

                David.

                AnticimexA Offline
                AnticimexA Offline
                Anticimex
                Contest Winner
                wrote on last edited by
                #235

                @carlierd you have a lot of st=fail, so your problem is radio related, not signing related. I also see non nonce related messages fail so you need to stabilize your rf connection before signing can work. And since signing uses the maximum payload size, it has the least probability to succeed to be sent, so you could find that unsigned messages work while nonces and signed messages fail, but this is normal of the rf link is not fully working. If you get st=fail, it is a radio problem. See this discussion for details: http://forum.mysensors.org/topic/3386/mqttclientgateway-broken-after-upgrade-signature-failure

                Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

                carlierdC 1 Reply Last reply
                1
                • AnticimexA Anticimex

                  @carlierd you have a lot of st=fail, so your problem is radio related, not signing related. I also see non nonce related messages fail so you need to stabilize your rf connection before signing can work. And since signing uses the maximum payload size, it has the least probability to succeed to be sent, so you could find that unsigned messages work while nonces and signed messages fail, but this is normal of the rf link is not fully working. If you get st=fail, it is a radio problem. See this discussion for details: http://forum.mysensors.org/topic/3386/mqttclientgateway-broken-after-upgrade-signature-failure

                  carlierdC Offline
                  carlierdC Offline
                  carlierd
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #236

                  @Anticimex Hello. Everything is working at 16 or 8MHz so I am pretty sure it's not an issue with the material.
                  I will burn the bootloader again and create a new post if it's still not correct. I will also disable signing feature to be sure there is no impact.

                  David.

                  AnticimexA 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • carlierdC carlierd

                    @Anticimex Hello. Everything is working at 16 or 8MHz so I am pretty sure it's not an issue with the material.
                    I will burn the bootloader again and create a new post if it's still not correct. I will also disable signing feature to be sure there is no impact.

                    David.

                    AnticimexA Offline
                    AnticimexA Offline
                    Anticimex
                    Contest Winner
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #237

                    @carlierd well, st=fail indicate transmission failure so it is pretty clear that you have a issue with rf, at least on that frequency. st=fail is not signing related. But, like previously discussed, enabling signing can trigger more st=fail because the payload gets bigger and is more sensitive to noise.

                    Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

                    carlierdC 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • T Offline
                      T Offline
                      tomkxy
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #238

                      @calierd You can have a look here at the discussion I had with a similar problem which I was able to resolve finally. See the last reply in the aforementioned thread where I summarized how I resolved it, eventually.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • AnticimexA Anticimex

                        @carlierd well, st=fail indicate transmission failure so it is pretty clear that you have a issue with rf, at least on that frequency. st=fail is not signing related. But, like previously discussed, enabling signing can trigger more st=fail because the payload gets bigger and is more sensitive to noise.

                        carlierdC Offline
                        carlierdC Offline
                        carlierd
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #239

                        @Anticimex @tomkxy
                        Perhaps the arduino and RFM69 can't run at 1MHz. I have capacitors and I tried with two different power sources. Without signing it's better but still a lot of st=fail. No matter, it was just for testing purpose :)

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • T Offline
                          T Offline
                          tomkxy
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #240

                          @calierd I cannot comment on RFM69 since I have non in operation. Sorry, try to place the nodes further apart and look whether it changes.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • duovisD Offline
                            duovisD Offline
                            duovis
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #241

                            @Anticimex Thank you for the effort you have put into signing, this is great!

                            Would it make sense to explore the I2C version of ATSHA204A ? The reason I'm asking is speed.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • AnticimexA Offline
                              AnticimexA Offline
                              Anticimex
                              Contest Winner
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #242

                              Thanks @duovis,
                              Yes, I welcome anyone who has the HW to provide a IO routine for I2C-variants of ATSHA204A. I don't have the hw myself though.

                              Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

                              duovisD 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • AnticimexA Anticimex

                                Thanks @duovis,
                                Yes, I welcome anyone who has the HW to provide a IO routine for I2C-variants of ATSHA204A. I don't have the hw myself though.

                                duovisD Offline
                                duovisD Offline
                                duovis
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #243

                                @Anticimex Ok, I'll try to play with it and see if I can come up with something that works on I2C.

                                AnticimexA 1 Reply Last reply
                                1
                                • duovisD duovis

                                  @Anticimex Ok, I'll try to play with it and see if I can come up with something that works on I2C.

                                  AnticimexA Offline
                                  AnticimexA Offline
                                  Anticimex
                                  Contest Winner
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #244

                                  @duovis Great. I'll happily review any code. You should only need to worry about the low level stuff.

                                  Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • SoloamS Offline
                                    SoloamS Offline
                                    Soloam
                                    Hardware Contributor
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #245

                                    Hello all!

                                    Two fast question! Can I have nodes working with ATSHA204A chip and others with software?

                                    And, can I have nodes with signing on and others off? Or if I add signing to my network, all nodes must have it?

                                    Thank you all!

                                    AnticimexA 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • SoloamS Soloam

                                      Hello all!

                                      Two fast question! Can I have nodes working with ATSHA204A chip and others with software?

                                      And, can I have nodes with signing on and others off? Or if I add signing to my network, all nodes must have it?

                                      Thank you all!

                                      AnticimexA Offline
                                      AnticimexA Offline
                                      Anticimex
                                      Contest Winner
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #246

                                      @Soloam
                                      You can mix nodes with soft signing and ATSHA signing as you like.
                                      You can mix nodes with signing on and off as well. The GW will only sign messages to nodes that require it, and it will also only check signatures from nodes that require signatures. So you can have one node which support/require signing and another which don't. The GW will be able to exchange messages with both nodes.

                                      Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • SoloamS Offline
                                        SoloamS Offline
                                        Soloam
                                        Hardware Contributor
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #247

                                        Great work indeed!

                                        Thank you @Anticimex

                                        AnticimexA 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • SoloamS Soloam

                                          Great work indeed!

                                          Thank you @Anticimex

                                          AnticimexA Offline
                                          AnticimexA Offline
                                          Anticimex
                                          Contest Winner
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #248

                                          @Soloam thanks :)

                                          Do you feel secure today? No? Start requiring some signatures and feel better tomorrow ;)

                                          1 Reply Last reply
                                          0
                                          Reply
                                          • Reply as topic
                                          Log in to reply
                                          • Oldest to Newest
                                          • Newest to Oldest
                                          • Most Votes


                                          7

                                          Online

                                          11.7k

                                          Users

                                          11.2k

                                          Topics

                                          113.0k

                                          Posts


                                          Copyright 2019 TBD   |   Forum Guidelines   |   Privacy Policy   |   Terms of Service
                                          • Login

                                          • Don't have an account? Register

                                          • Login or register to search.
                                          • First post
                                            Last post
                                          0
                                          • MySensors
                                          • OpenHardware.io
                                          • Categories
                                          • Recent
                                          • Tags
                                          • Popular