Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?

[d00616]

@gohan said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

I need to get some nrf24 but I'm unsure to start moving to the nrf5x or not.

IMHO the only missing feature to start is OTA updates. Implementing OTA updates is a question of (my) time. On the other hand the ATMEGA limitations like PROGMEM dealing, 2k RAM or slow speed cannot be fixed. With nRF5 you haven't care about used RAM or Flash. The radio protocol can easily changed to support encryption at the RFM level.

[NeverDie]

@d00616
Well said. I think we're all going to be so much happier with the nRF5 series that later we're all going to be wondering why we didn't switch sooner.

[NeverDie]

@Nca78 said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

They also have through hole version that use a much smaller crystal

It turns out I have this product already. I purchased it two years ago from a different seller on ebay. A couple small observations about it:

1. I really do doubt that it's a 4-layer board as they are claiming. The board is very thin, and I don't see any evidence of there being more layers than just top and bottom.

2. The NRF24L01 chip on the module I have is rotated 180 degrees relative to the one in the Ebyte rendering.
   
   However, all the lettering on the chip is exactly the same.

Here are some photos of it:

[NeverDie]

Here is what I wrote about it on August 3,2015 in the "Which are the best nrf24l01+ modules?" thread:

I received the NRF24L01+'s that are on the red PCB's (above), and when I saw they were using the now notorious 1242AF chips, I had little hope. However, I tested them at 1mbps over the same challenge distance as the others, and so far they're doing very well: I transmitted over 200,000 packets, and there were only 0.03% lost packets. Average round trip time was 2.2ms.

As before, I'm using the RFToys to do the testing. The modules seem more finicky about their orientation than others that I've tested, and moving things just a little can make for much, much worse results.

I bought them from MDFly on ebay.

[NeverDie]

It seems that the red modules were fakes. Here's what I wrote on August 15, 2015 in the other thread:

Based on the mA and uA measurements above, it's likely that the Addicore modules and the red modules are based on the Si24R01, because they are a reasonably good match for the electrical specifications on page 22 of the Si24R01 datasheet: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kdenpdg60v5hzbd/AACG1jxQR71fkzX-U4a7CIh0a/SI24R1 (cn).pdf?dl=0

I haven't tested the red modules from Ebyte, so I can't say whether the same will apply to them. Maybe Ebyte is using genuine Nordic nrf24L01 chips, as they claim. However, given the above, I wouldn't take it for granted that they necessarily are.

[NeverDie]

For reference, here's a better photo of the red nRF24L01+ board that I had previously tested in 2015:

[NeverDie]

I see that there's another Aliexpress store that's selling what looks like the same module for almost half the price:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/E01-ML01D-Imported-components-nRF24L01-2-4G-wireless-transceiver-RF-data-transmission-module-industrial-grade-imported/32817210922.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.31.yf0kqS&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_5_10152_10065_10151_10068_10130_10084_10083_10119_10080_10082_10081_10110_10178_10137_10111_10060_10112_10113_10155_10114_10154_438_10056_10055_10054_10182_10059_100031_10099_10078_10079_10103_10073_10102_10120_5360020_10189_10052_10053_10142_10107_10050_10051,searchweb201603_2,ppcSwitch_4&btsid=7cb3695c-3e0d-40fe-8806-e962a3d54db1&algo_expid=2d68395c-5638-4e8a-8b27-4dacf8ca0318-4&algo_pvid=2d68395c-5638-4e8a-8b27-4dacf8ca0318

Anyhow, it's conceivable that eByte is simply reselling these red modules. Its other modules are blue, so I'm hoping that's the case, and that its blue modules might be better.

[d00616]

@NeverDie said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

Anyhow, it's conceivable that eByte is simply reselling these red modules. Its other modules are blue, so I'm hoping that's the case, and that its blue modules might be better.

It's also the same module name. This could be also a fake of the eByte modules.

I't looks like, there is no trusted source for nRF24 modules.

[NeverDie]

I think consistency probably matters more than genuine vs. fake. In other words, if you end up with fakes, try to make sure that all your radios are all the same fake. It gets confusing when you start to mix different kinds together, because different variants can have different idiosyncrasies, and then you start to wonder whether a problem you might be having is due to a chip difference, or mix of differences, or something else. Very quickly the combinatoric complexity rises and troubleshooting becomes more time consuming.

[gohan]

@NeverDie the problem is to be able to find good and fake one so that you could mark them with different colors. Not everyone have the tools 😀

[NeverDie]

@gohan
So what? Some people live in rural Africa without electricity or running water, and they don't have soldering irons or even solder or even any money. Are we going to worry about whether they can do this as well? I mean, where do you draw the line? The way I see it: if a hobbyist really wants to know if a particular chip is fake or genuine, then they can either buy or borrow or rent an o-scope for long enough to figure it out. The other thread tells how to figure it out using an o-scope. Prior to that thread, I had never even used an o-scope. So, the required skill level isn't very high at all.

[Nca78]

@NeverDie but even low end oscilloscope is over 200$/€, it's expensive for a hobby.
I don't have one, because it's too much money for the use I would have of it at the moment, and I wouldn't even have a place to store it :D

And I don't know who I could borrow an oscilloscope from, so the quest to find a reliable supplier is worth it for me. Even if I think it will only end with buying NRF5.

[NeverDie]

@Nca78
In that case you could get the job done using one of the ARM chips that comes with a fast sampling AD converter and, preferably, lots of RAM. You could get it on one of the cheap demo boards to make the project easier. Fortunately, the fake nrf24's are different enough from the genuine in their Tx and Rx current draws that you won't need to split hairs on your measurements to tell them apart.

I did something similar once for capturing and decoding RF signals using an Arduino Due, so I'm sure it can be done. In fact, you could probably use a Due for this if you wanted to, but no doubt there are better options available now.

[Yveaux]

@NeverDie said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

Fortunately, the fake nrf24's are different enough from the genuine in their Tx and Rx current draws that you won't need to split hairs on your measurements to tell them apart.

Nope. Some of them might be, but certainly not all of them...

[NeverDie]

@Yveaux said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

@NeverDie said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

Fortunately, the fake nrf24's are different enough from the genuine in their Tx and Rx current draws that you won't need to split hairs on your measurements to tell them apart.

Nope. Some of them might be, but certainly not all of them...

Which ones? Even the fakes have names and datasheets. The datasheet tells the tale. The ones I tested (see other thread for the details) were pretty noticeably different.

[Yveaux]

@NeverDie said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

Which ones? Even the fakes have names and datasheets. The datasheet tells the tale.

I've ordered many nameless modules (regular black ones) through Ali express the past years, which didn't come with a datasheet or any specs. A number of them are proven fakes (some even x-rayed by Nordic), but I've not seen any of them having a current consumption significantly different from original Nordic modules.
I just want to stress again that although some fake modules have a higher current consumption, this certainly isn't true for all fake modules.
A module with regular consumption still could be fake. X-ray is the only way to be 100% certain.

[NeverDie]

@Yveaux

What was it about the chips (the ones that had identical current draws to the real thing) that you sent to Nordic for x-ray that motivated you to send them?

If your requirement is 100% certainty, then you may just have to make your own modules with chips procured either direct from Nordic or from a trusted supplier, like Digikey.

[Yveaux]

@NeverDie said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

If your requirement is 100% certainty

That's not my requirement; I didn't start this thread :laughing:
I only have (presumably) fakes deployed around the house and they've never failed me. I won't bother getting 100% genuine ones.

[d00616]

I have received two of the red modules. This is an X-Ray image of the chip (montage)

[NeverDie]

@d00616 said in Where to get legit nRF24L01+ modules?:

I have received two of the red modules. This is an X-Ray image of the chip (montage)

Meaning?