Sensebender Micro



  • @tbowmo It was just a thought I came up with and thought to share my idea and arguments. 🙂
    I think the Sensebender Micro is great especially if you would like to monitor temperatures (which of course many of us wants to), but I just think that a less expensive, light option (that would be available to order... 🙂 ) could appeal to many. Great that you have requested a quote!


  • Hero Member

    Just as a reference, the boost regulators I did, based on the TPS61221, cost something like $1.7, including the (very small) PCB. The TPS61221 is about $1 out of that cost. And I did not use the cheapest inductor exactly. Plus the cost of small volumes and ordering each component individually from AliExpress.

    Don't have any testing equipment, and I haven't done any long term tests, but the prototype I did was perfectly able to run a mysensors node, including the motion detector module, and a small buzzer, on just one AA battery.

    Not to say that I also wouldn't like pads for the Si7021 at least. It's a damn fine chip, hence the cost.

    I think that in the long run, we should think about some sort of mini shield system where a base board can be extended, so (almost) everyone can get what they want. At the expense of bulkier designs, but it would be a choice for the end-user and everything comes at a cost anyway.


  • Hardware Contributor

    Got mine yesterday (Switzerland)!

    I really like the design of the board. Only improvement I wish: integrated NRF24L01+ 🙂



  • @tbowmo, ah, sorry misunderstanding then. I thought it was the atsha204 that was contributing 30% of the cost, but I guess it's the Si7021, which is rather useful to have!



  • Was anybody able to track the Micros. My tracking said it left HongKong on 04.06.2015 and I am wondering why you already received your items.


  • Contest Winner

    @gloob
    same here. Has left on 04.06.2015 - no more info. Also on local post service (link below on hk post) no entry.
    As I live in Germany and the post is on strike and our customs work with "german gründlichkeit" I dont expect it to arrive too fast...


  • Admin

    Mine came in this Monday. One of them has been running since.

    Screen Shot 2015-06-11 at 09.44.46.png

    It is a tracked mail/package so Itead probably has the number somewhere.


  • Admin

    @hawk_2050 said:

    @tbowmo, ah, sorry misunderstanding then. I thought it was the atsha204 that was contributing 30% of the cost, but I guess it's the Si7021, which is rather useful to have!

    Yup it's the Si7021.. It's about 5$ in low quantities from Mouser (Think that itead has a better source thouǵh)


  • Hero Member

    I received mine today. I would be interested in a lower cost version as well that doesn't include the temp & humidity sensor.

    Cheers
    Al



  • Hello,

    Can some one measure the real power consumption of the sensebender with the default sketch (humidity, temperature, battery level) running and the nrf24l01 module?

    Would like to get an idea of home many µA are used in active mode and how many µA in sleep mode the sensebender is taking.



  • Lucky yous, I am still waiting for delivery in Canada.
    Looks as though it will be next week as Friday mail has past.


  • Hero Member

    Still waiting here on the East Coast...



  • My two have arrived, up and running in Domoticz as WTGR800 temp + hum.



  • Jus measured power consumption:

    44.66 µA - when sleep
    between 11mA and 14mA when transmitting (every minute, default sketch)

    I was using my Fluke 287.



  • and graph...F2.jpg



  • My order arrived in the US midwest today (shipped from HK on June 3). I hooked one up to a CR123 to test and it worked right out of the box. I do not know much about battery operation and have a question about the battery monitoring - Do I need to alter the sketch for the CR123 vs the original 2 x AA? Or a 3V coincell?

    SBMicro.jpg


  • Admin

    @filipq

    Just measured mine using a uCurrent and I get the same figures with an genuine NRF24L01 and what I thought was a NRF clone...

    45µA at sleep and about just above 10mA when transmitting.

    Mind the mess...

    20150614_195330.jpg


  • Hero Member

    I like the wallpaper.😄 but how do you like your scope? I consider buying one myself


  • Admin

    @AWI

    The scope works great. But I would really need attend some sort of oscilloscope course. Soo many buttons and functions. I get lost sometimes 😜



  • I'm still waiting for my delivery in germany. I hope that it will arrive soon.
    Currently I think it is stuck in customs as many others received the items already from china.



  • Got them last night in Canada.



  • I'm still waiting in germany, customs in this country have "Deutsche Gründlichkeit". Sticking their Nose in every bullshit ;-).
    So still waiting .
    Greets Stefan


  • Hero Member

    Received mine yesterday.



  • In Domoticz I also see sensors hemidity and sensors temperature with the type LaCrosse TX3. Does anyone know what they are?


  • Admin

    @hetbeest

    I think that occasionally, domoticz only get the temperature, or the humidity in a single transmission, and then decides that it's another sensor type and therefore create a new instance for it.

    Sensebender always sends both temperature and humidity readings together (in two different messages, as it's two different sensor child ids that is used).


  • Admin

    How many would be interested in a Sensebender Micro LE (light edition), and how many units would you buy?

    The Light edition would be without Si7021, and external flash.

    I do not have any prices yet, as we need to have some expected sales figures to give to our partner. We need batch sizes of at least 100 units (preferably larger like 200) otherwise setup fees, etc. would eat away on the savings from removing the components.


  • Hero Member

    @tbowmo said:

    How many would be interested in a Sensebender Micro LE (light edition), and how many units would you buy?

    I would take 3-5 depending on the prize.


  • Hero Member

    @tbowmo It's really going to depend on the price. It would have to be a significant savings to drop the Si7021 and Flash for me.


  • Admin

    @korttoma @ServiceXp

    I haven't got any numbers from itead, but from the prices that I get from mouser, we could probably save around 4$ if we skip Si7021 and external flash.

    This is still more than the cheap mini clones etc. but the problem here, is that we are running in low volume batches. The setup fees for each batch is rather high, and this has to be divided out on each board in the batch.


  • Hero Member

    @tbowmo For me, 4 bucks is NOT worth it.


  • Hero Member

    @ServiceXp @tbowmo - Agree not worth bothering for $4

    Ive ordered 4 units in 2nd batch...



  • Ps. Main page at http://www.mysensors.org/hardware/micro still says preorder but when clicking through imall has in stock.



  • I ordered another couple a few days ago.


  • Admin

    @shabba

    We don't get notifications from itead, when they change the status in their shop.. So we have to check it ourself..



  • update: I got my 3 pcb from pre-order today (germany) and it works fine - really great design! 👍


  • Hero Member

    @tbowmo I wanna say Thank You again. I really love how small this sensor is. You did a great job!!!!



  • I have mine up and running @tbowmo this is great thank you also.
    Now to learn how to graph my results.



  • I have mine up and running and MYScontroller sees them.
    i'm trying to send and OTA to these devices. but it doesn't seem to be working.

    @hek can you confirm these came with the correct bootloader to do this? i thought i read in the start of the thread it would.

    when i try to send a OTA nothing happens.

    anyone have this working that can comment on what needs to be done to get it working?

    Thanks!


  • Admin

    @mvader

    The OTA->flash requires sketches running library code from the development branch (which it isn't currently). The boards comes preloaded with the correct bootloader that supports moving firmware from flash->program memory at boot-time.

    But something must load the flash over-the-air also. This requires that you:

    • Compile the sketch using the dev-branch
    • Enable MY_OTA_FRIMWARE_FEATURE in MyConfig.h
    • Keep node awake
    • Call gw.process() in loop-section (which handles the fw-update-commands in the background and resets node when a new firmware has been uploaded).

    Now that I have received my board I can actually test this code I wrote a while back:). I hope it won't bee too many bugs in it.

    But note that the default temp/hum sketch on these boards sleeps most of the time it wouldn't hear the fw-update requests anyway. It would probably be better to use this feature on boards that always is awake.

    For more information on what is actually happening in gw-process you can look at the code that was added in this push:
    https://github.com/mysensors/Arduino/commit/3a59929b8ed8e1fca9876031264db5d6626876ff



  • @hek said:

    A->flash requires sketches running library code from the development branch (which it isn't currently). The boards comes

    thanks for the info. I was hoping i wouldn't have to connect up my programmer.. oh well.



  • I guess these can't be programmed, if my programmer doesn't have a DTR line?
    was hoping OTA would work 🙂
    I'll order a new programmer any way, but if there is any other way let me know.
    I tried starting it in test mode. but that didn't work


  • Admin

    @mvader

    It's using a standard ftdi header, as used in the arduino mini pro.

    About the testmode, you should hold A0 to GND, while applying power to the unit. Then it starts spewing data to the serial port.



  • Just recieve my 5 sensbender today. Workin fine after some problem with nrf24L01 and Arduino uno (+3.3V doesn't work)


  • Admin

    It's almost too easy to setup a sensor network (for temperature and humidity) now.

    solder a socket for the NRF module, a battery holder. Plug in the NRF module, put batteries in, and you have a sensor online. (I have 3 sensebenders from tiead online at the moment, together with 2 prototypes). Need to get some more battery holders, before I can make more sensors now.


  • Admin

    @tbowmo said:

    It's almost too easy to setup a sensor network (for temperature and humidity) now.

    I agree! I ordered 4 from the second ITead batch (I let others get their hands on the first batch because I already had a couple OSHPark deployed) and had the first sensor up and running in no time! Great job and contribution to the MySensor's community! 👍 👍 👍


  • Admin

    @blacey

    Thanks.. It's actually kind of fun, when I see that things I have created, actually brings value to other people.. Always been a driving force for me (no matter what I have had my hands in, whether it's software of various types,VHF radios for ships, mobile phones, bluetooth headsets, or sensor modules 🙂 )



  • @tbowmo said:

    @mvader

    It's using a standard ftdi header, as used in the arduino mini pro.

    About the testmode, you should hold A0 to GND, while applying power to the unit. Then it starts spewing data to the serial port.

    I had meant that i put it in test mode to try and program it.
    getting it in test mode worked. i could see the led blinking.

    however when i gave up and put the radio back on and turn it on, i guess it had actually taken my upload.
    it was reporting in F now.
    so i know the DTR does the auto reset, i guess upload works, but no reset and/or completed msg in the IDE.

    i ordered a new programmer anyway with DTR.



  • Hi,

    I've received some boards and all working good.

    I'd like to upload a new sketch to the Sensebender Micro board and I'm attempting to do this via the FTDI FT232RL USB to TTL serial converter adapter that I purchased here (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221552218333).

    Could someone kindly confirm the pin to pin mapping between the FTDI board and the Senseboard Micro as when I attempt to upload I receive the message:

       Programmer Type : butterfly
             Description     : Atmel AppNote AVR109 Boot Loader
    
    Connecting to programmer: .avrdude: butterfly_recv(): programmer is not responding
    
    Problem uploading to board.  See http://www.arduino.cc/en/Guide/Troubleshooting#upload for suggestions.
    

    I'm using Arduino 1.6.5 running on Windows 8.1 (inside parallels on a Mac).

    Any ideas?

    Thank you

    Nutz


  • Admin

    @nutcracker

    I usually use the GND pin as a guide.
    What happens if you run Arduino IDE directly in your native OS?



  • Thanks @hek. I've had to run Arduino on Windows before because of compatibility issues with certain chip sets on Arduino boards and I didn't fancy running unsigned drivers on my Mac to resolve... I'm able to upload sketches to other boards with no issues.

    That said, I've updated Arduino to 1.6.5 on my Mac and have attempted to upload the default Sensebendermicro.ino sketch to the micro with a similar error:

    Arduino: 1.6.5 (Mac OS X), Board: "Arduino Micro"
    
    Build options changed, rebuilding all
    
    Sketch uses 26,414 bytes (92%) of program storage space. Maximum is 28,672 bytes.
    Global variables use 799 bytes (31%) of dynamic memory, leaving 1,761 bytes for local variables. Maximum is 2,560 bytes.
    Found programmer: Id = "�d��b�"; type = F
        Software Version = �.�; Hardware Version = �.�
    avrdude: error: buffered memory access not supported. Maybe it isn't
    a butterfly/AVR109 but a AVR910 device?
    Problem uploading to board.  See http://www.arduino.cc/en/Guide/Troubleshooting#upload for suggestions.
    
      This report would have more information with
      "Show verbose output during compilation"
      enabled in File > Preferences.
    
    

    With verbose output enabled:

    avrdude: Version 6.0.1, compiled on Apr 14 2015 at 16:30:25
             Copyright (c) 2000-2005 Brian Dean, http://www.bdmicro.com/
             Copyright (c) 2007-2009 Joerg Wunsch
    
             System wide configuration file is "/Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Java/hardware/tools/avr/etc/avrdude.conf"
             User configuration file is "/Users/nutcracker/.avrduderc"
             User configuration file does not exist or is not a regular file, skipping
    
             Using Port                    : /dev/cu.usbserial-A50285BI
             Using Programmer              : avr109
             Overriding Baud Rate          : 57600
             AVR Part                      : ATmega32U4
             Chip Erase delay              : 9000 us
             PAGEL                         : PD7
             BS2                           : PA0
             RESET disposition             : dedicated
             RETRY pulse                   : SCK
             serial program mode           : yes
             parallel program mode         : yes
             Timeout                       : 200
             StabDelay                     : 100
             CmdexeDelay                   : 25
             SyncLoops                     : 32
             ByteDelay                     : 0
             PollIndex                     : 3
             PollValue                     : 0x53
             Memory Detail                 :
    
                                      Block Poll               Page                       Polled
               Memory Type Mode Delay Size  Indx Paged  Size   Size #Pages MinW  MaxW   ReadBack
               ----------- ---- ----- ----- ---- ------ ------ ---- ------ ----- ----- ---------
               eeprom        65    20     4    0 no       1024    4      0  9000  9000 0x00 0x00
               flash         65     6   128    0 yes     32768  128    256  4500  4500 0x00 0x00
               lfuse          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  9000  9000 0x00 0x00
               hfuse          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  9000  9000 0x00 0x00
               efuse          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  9000  9000 0x00 0x00
               lock           0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  9000  9000 0x00 0x00
               calibration    0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
               signature      0     0     0    0 no          3    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
    
             Programmer Type : butterfly
             Description     : Atmel AppNote AVR109 Boot Loader
    
    Connecting to programmer: .avrdude: butterfly_recv(): programmer is not responding
    Problem uploading to board.  See http://www.arduino.cc/en/Guide/Troubleshooting#upload for suggestions.
    

    Nutz


  • Admin

    @nutcracker said:

    Maybe it isn't
    a butterfly/AVR109 but a AVR910 device?

    Is your programmer setting in Arduino IDE set to "USBasp"?



  • Hi @hek, I've never had to change the programmer setting before... I've changed it to USBasp and re-uploaded but same error. I've always used the menu options Sketch=>Upload to upload a sketch to the board. Should I be using Sketch=>Upload via programmer for this micro board ? If so, that fails too but something to do with it not being able to find the USB device.

    avrdude: Version 6.0.1, compiled on Apr 14 2015 at 16:30:25
             Copyright (c) 2000-2005 Brian Dean, http://www.bdmicro.com/
             Copyright (c) 2007-2009 Joerg Wunsch
    
             System wide configuration file is "/Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Java/hardware/tools/avr/etc/avrdude.conf"
             User configuration file is "/Users/nutcracker/.avrduderc"
             User configuration file does not exist or is not a regular file, skipping
    
             Using Port                    : usb
             Using Programmer              : usbasp
    avrdude: error: could not find USB device with vid=0x16c0 pid=0x5dc vendor='www.fischl.de' product='USBasp'
    
    avrdude done.  Thank you.
    

    Nutz


  • Admin

    Hmm. I think I understand what the problem is now. You've selected the "Arduino Micro" board. Not our "MySensors/Sensebender Micro" .

    Did you follow the instructions here?
    http://www.mysensors.org/hardware/micro-ide-setup



  • Thanks @hek, I also realised my mistake once I retraced my steps...I hadn't scrolled down fully on that screenshot that shows the Sensebender Micro board... I think what through me is that screenshot also shows a "dot" against another board - the Arduino Micro board...and I was selecting that... duh! (may be worth changing the screenshot? ;))

    Anyway, thanks for your help...sketch uploaded perfectly after that!

    avrdude: Version 6.0.1, compiled on Apr 14 2015 at 16:30:25
             Copyright (c) 2000-2005 Brian Dean, http://www.bdmicro.com/
             Copyright (c) 2007-2009 Joerg Wunsch
    
             System wide configuration file is "/Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Java/hardware/tools/avr/etc/avrdude.conf"
             User configuration file is "/Users/nutcracker/.avrduderc"
             User configuration file does not exist or is not a regular file, skipping
    
             Using Port                    : /dev/cu.usbserial-A50285BI
             Using Programmer              : arduino
             Overriding Baud Rate          : 57600
             AVR Part                      : ATmega328P
             Chip Erase delay              : 9000 us
             PAGEL                         : PD7
             BS2                           : PC2
             RESET disposition             : dedicated
             RETRY pulse                   : SCK
             serial program mode           : yes
             parallel program mode         : yes
             Timeout                       : 200
             StabDelay                     : 100
             CmdexeDelay                   : 25
             SyncLoops                     : 32
             ByteDelay                     : 0
             PollIndex                     : 3
             PollValue                     : 0x53
             Memory Detail                 :
    
                                      Block Poll               Page                       Polled
               Memory Type Mode Delay Size  Indx Paged  Size   Size #Pages MinW  MaxW   ReadBack
               ----------- ---- ----- ----- ---- ------ ------ ---- ------ ----- ----- ---------
               eeprom        65    20     4    0 no       1024    4      0  3600  3600 0xff 0xff
               flash         65     6   128    0 yes     32768  128    256  4500  4500 0xff 0xff
               lfuse          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  4500  4500 0x00 0x00
               hfuse          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  4500  4500 0x00 0x00
               efuse          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  4500  4500 0x00 0x00
               lock           0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0  4500  4500 0x00 0x00
               calibration    0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
               signature      0     0     0    0 no          3    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
    
             Programmer Type : Arduino
             Description     : Arduino
             Hardware Version: 3
             Firmware Version: 5.0
             Vtarget         : 0.3 V
             Varef           : 0.3 V
             Oscillator      : 28.800 kHz
             SCK period      : 3.3 us
    
    avrdude: AVR device initialized and ready to accept instructions
    
    Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.00s
    
    avrdude: Device signature = 0x1e950f
    avrdude: reading input file "/var/folders/r3/_6srq76n0mz4kmh86hsy4y2m0000gn/T/build4750928375396503439.tmp/SensebenderMicro.cpp.hex"
    avrdude: writing flash (23678 bytes):
    
    Writing | ################################################## | 100% 8.84s
    
    avrdude: 23678 bytes of flash written
    avrdude: verifying flash memory against /var/folders/r3/_6srq76n0mz4kmh86hsy4y2m0000gn/T/build4750928375396503439.tmp/SensebenderMicro.cpp.hex:
    avrdude: load data flash data from input file /var/folders/r3/_6srq76n0mz4kmh86hsy4y2m0000gn/T/build4750928375396503439.tmp/SensebenderMicro.cpp.hex:
    avrdude: input file /var/folders/r3/_6srq76n0mz4kmh86hsy4y2m0000gn/T/build4750928375396503439.tmp/SensebenderMicro.cpp.hex contains 23678 bytes
    avrdude: reading on-chip flash data:
    
    Reading | ################################################## | 100% 9.94s
    
    avrdude: verifying ...
    avrdude: 23678 bytes of flash verified
    
    avrdude done.  Thank you.
    

    Cheers!

    Nutz


  • Admin

    Ah... there is a dot in the menu-image. Will update it. Thanks.


  • Hero Member

    @hek Interesting.. I didn't know this.. I used the standard Pro Mini 3v3 and it worked...????



  • Received my Micros today. Luckily there was no custom and a lot of pins to solder. Can't wait to solder them on wednesday on work and test them.

    Is there any instruction how to solder everything? On which side the radio module needs to be soldered.


  • Admin

    @gloob

    This might help you out 🙂



  • I hope this question has not been answered already and I did not miss the answer. I was thinking about connecting a motion sensor to this and was hoping that one of the digital pins supports an interrupt. Is there an interrupt available?


  • Admin

    @gbfromhb

    D3 is available on the side-pins. D2 is routed to the radio but can be used with some hacking.



  • @gbfromhb said:

    I hope this question has not been answered already and I did not miss the answer. I was thinking about connecting a motion sensor to this and was hoping that one of the digital pins supports an interrupt. Is there an interrupt available?

    I'm planning to do the same thing.
    i ordered my 5v step up regulators to support the PIR sensor.
    although I hope adding the motion isnt going to kill the batteries.



  • @mvader
    I have so far had no problems running my PIR sensors at 3.3v with the following hack.

    http://techgurka.blogspot.com/2013/05/cheap-pyroelectric-infrared-pir-motion.html

    You can not do this with all PIR Sensors from what I understand, but one of the ones listed in the MySensors store is what I've been using. Go down to the bottom of the article.



  • @Hek
    Thanks, I saw the D3, but I'm new enough to this adventure that I was not sure if I should have assumed that it also had an interrupt like all the other boards.


  • Admin

    @gbfromhb

    I tried to keep the naming, and pins on the atmega, the same as an ordinary arduino 🙂



  • @gbfromhb said:

    @mvader
    I have so far had no problems running my PIR sensors at 3.3v with the following hack.

    http://techgurka.blogspot.com/2013/05/cheap-pyroelectric-infrared-pir-motion.html

    You can not do this with all PIR Sensors from what I understand, but one of the ones listed in the MySensors store is what I've been using. Go down to the bottom of the article.

    wow.. nice.. thanks for the info! I will give this a go asap.



  • Hello,

    I have one more question. Is it possible to power the micro from the ftdi pins? I would like to use jumper wires.


  • Admin

    @gloob

    Yes it's possible to power it from the FTDI pins, if you want to..



  • Are there any recommendations for a low power temperature, humidity sensor regarding the update cycle.

    Currently I plan to wake up the sensor each 10 minutes instead of each 1 minute to update the values. This should increase the duration of the battery. A complete update of all values if performed each 30 minutes as usual.


  • Admin

    I would probably choose 5 minutes interval instead.. I have updated the sensebendermicro sketch tonight (just waiting for @hek to approve it). so it holds of on the transmissions a bit. Now the temperature needs to change more than 0.5 degrees from the previous transmitted value. OR
    humidity needs to change more than 0.5, measured with a moving average. OR
    30 minutes since last transmission.



  • I found that when I power the micro from 2 batteries I get the following error:

    T: 23.21
    H: 50
    send: 104-104-0-0 s=1,c=1,t=0,pt=7,l=5,st=fail:23.2
    send: 104-104-0-0 s=2,c=1,t=1,pt=2,l=2,st=fail:50
    

    This does not happen when I power it from the FTDI programmer.
    Does anybody have any ideas?
    The batteries have a voltage of 3.25V

    I did not have this issues with my arduino nano sensors. and i did use the same radio modules.

    When I check the modules they seem to be real nrf24l01+ modules:

    
    STATUS		 = 0x0e RX_DR=0 TX_DS=0 MAX_RT=0 RX_P_NO=7 TX_FULL=0
    RX_ADDR_P0-1	� = 0xe7e7e7e7e7 0xf0f0f0f0d2
    RX_ADDR_P2-5	� = 0xc3 0xc4 0xc5 0xc6
    TX_ADDR		 = 0xe7e7e7e7e7
    RX_PW_P0-6	� = 0x00 0x20 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00
    EN_AA		 = 0x3f
    EN_RXADDR	� = 0x03
    RF_CH		 = 0x4c
    RF_SETUP	� = 0x07
    CONFIG		 = 0x0f
    DYNPD/FEATURE	� = 0x00 0x00
    Data Rate	 = 1MBPS
    Model		 = nRF24L01+
    CRC Length	 = 16 bits
    PA Power	 = PA_HIGH
    


  • I have a batch of 5 sensebender and actually I build 3 and one of them doesn't work properly. Lot of st:fail when I put my finger on the board it works better so I try to make all solder one more time but it's not ok. I try with few radios and same radios work well on the others sensbender.
    Any idea or way to exchange with Itead ?


  • Admin

    @Fabien

    Where exactly do you put your finger on it, in order to get it working?


  • Admin

    @gloob

    It's the same power rail (FTDI, and the battery connector). What do you supply the board with, thru the FTDI header?



  • @tbowmo difficult to answer this question. It seems to be on Atmega but after trying to resold it's not better. I resol capacitors, resistors ... I don't know what to do now ...


  • Admin

    @Fabien

    Did you also resolder the atmega itself?

    Could you try and measure supply current it uses?



  • current when powering on : 20 mA and during sleeping about 20uA (not very accurate).


  • Admin

    @Fabien

    Have you tried to add an extra capacitor to the NRF module, on the one that's bad? (Could be your finger adds a bit more capacitance, I know it's a wild guess but just trying to think out loud)



  • Ok but wich value ? I just finish to solder my 4th sensebender and ok too.


  • Admin

    Does the failed messages reach their destination (gateway in your case)? As you might know it is the ack that never reaches the sensbender node which could be a result of power issues on the gateway side.



  • no, message are not recieve. I find someting :
    When I touch the NRF24 antenna (just a little it sifficient), it works. fine.
    Strange, same radio on other sensebender doesn't need this and other radio on this sensebender need to bo "touch".
    I try with 10uF additionnal on NRF but no change ...


  • Admin

    Do you use a socket or is the NRF module directly soldered onto the sensbender?

    (a bad connection in socket could be a problem... and when you press NRF module it has connection again)



  • Yes it's directly sold (and very hard to change with metallised hole). I will give a last try with another radio ...



  • Ok end of story ... sensebender card is dead ! 2 metallized hole were destroy by solder/unsoldering NRF modules.
    Hope my last Sensebender will work. And if there is a batch with light version I will reuse T/H sensor



  • @Fabien it seems that you have the same problem as me. I ordered a new set of radio modules to test if it is the fault of the radios. I will give feedback here about my progress.

    I aleady tried to add capacitors on the radio module but this did not help.
    There is also no difference if I power the micro from the FTDI or the battery connector.


  • Admin

    @Fabien

    Unfortunately I don't think there will be a light edition coming out at the moment. Currently the savings is way too small (I'm estimating a savings of 4-5$ compared to the full sensebender edition).


  • Admin



  • @gloob it's not a radio problem. Same radio works on the others boards.
    @hek I will try to repair the board ...



  • looking for some help programming this thing.
    I had a pl2303 usb programmer, but it had no DTR, so i orders a new usb programmer
    this one is a cp2102 with a DTR line.
    but still the same problem. it never uploads the code.
    i have the right board, processor and port chosen.
    i have tried all the programmers in the IDE but none work.
    it just says "uploading" and then eventually errors out.
    any suggestions?

    EDIT: nm i read something about switching tx and rx and i figured what the heck and surprise it worked..
    sketch uploaded..



  • Hi @tbowmo

    Thanks for bringing this great project to the community.

    I'm trying to understand the sensebender's power profile, especially the sleep current.

    I have previously done some measurements with the atmega328p (pro mini) + NRF. In addition to that I have also looked at the datasheets for the other components on the sensebender.

    It seems the theoretical low sleep current consumption is something like this:

    * nrf24l01+    900nA
    * atmega328p     5uA (with WD)
    * si7021        60nA
    * atsha204      30nA
    * at23df512c   300nA
      =  Total     6.3uA
    

    The SBMicro seems to draw ~50uA in sleep mode with the default configuration.

    I managed to put the flash memory into "ultra deep sleep"(*), causing the total consumption to drop to ~27uA. So there is still around 20uA that is not accounted for.

    I've also tried putting the atsha204 into sleep, but that did not make any difference (also confirmed by the specs).

    Are there some other settings/sleep modes that have not been enabled yet? What about the atmega itself?

    Do any of you have the a sensebender prototype with separate components, and can test sleep current by removing components one
    by one? (Before I start cutting traces on my own sensebenders in order to zero in on the target component).

    Is there something I'm missing?

    Datasheets:
    ATSHA204
    AT25DF512C
    Si7021 A20

    (*) in setup(): flash.initialize(); flash.ultra_deep_sleep() <- From datasheet


  • Admin

    @tlund

    Interesting figures.. are you sure that you've got a genuine nrf24 chip on the radio? Could be a fake with higher power consumption.



  • @tbowmo

    My NRF's are the same $1 nrf's listed in the mysensors store, so probably fake. But I have still measured them to draw ~900nA in powerDown.

    But I think I have found the culprint now. It seems the extra 20uA is caused by Arduino 1.6.5 (it may be that my installation is faulty).

    My test setup:

    • pro mini
    • nrf
    • a simple sketch that does gw.sleep(60s)

    1st test: sketch compiled & uploaded via Arduino 1.0.5-r2: 6uA
    2nd test: sketch compiled & uploaded via Arduino 1.6.5: 24uA


  • Admin

    @tlund

    Hmm could it be some optimization that causes the atmega to not go into deepest sleep mode?

    Maybe someone should have a look at the assembler output from a build with both versions of arduino



  • I'm back with bad news ... My 5th sensebender have a lot of st:fail like the first one. But now I know why !
    There is only one same things between the two board which fails : The FTDI connector. It's 90° connector and pins are just below the antenna. And I think tunning is not ok.
    So, when I go to work I try to remove the FTDI connector and see if connection is better !
    IMG_20150629_160855.jpg


  • Admin

    @Fabien

    That ftdi connector could have some effect on the antenna. I specifically made the area below the antenna empty, so that it wouldn't make any problems with the antenna.



  • So now the good news. I "repair" my 1st SenseBender (only two wire but one on the ATMega) and it works (with the same radio wich failed). I remove the FTDI header and everythings is ok. So now I'm sure the problem is the FTDI header near the antenna. And be carefull, we can have the same problem with battery for example. I suppose minimal distance is about 3.2 cm (lambda/4).
    But now I have a question : How can I update sketch without header (0° header doesn't fit in case). OTA ? Is ther a tutorial for OTA update with out of the box SenseBenderMicro ?

    Thank for your help !



  • I have the FTDI headers on the opposite site and I also get this transmission errors.
    I ordered a new batch of NRF24L01+ modules and will check if the problem still exists.



  • I have my FTDI headers on the other side as well and have no transmission errors.
    I am using genuine NRF+ radios though.
    could be the fakes causing a problem


  • Admin

    I have a male connector on my FTDI thingie, so I just put it in the mounting holes on the micro, and hold it to one of the sides, so it makes contact.



  • @tbowmo

    I tried uploading the sensebender sketch using 1.0.5-r2 with board config "pro mini 328 3.3V 8MHz". The si7021 doesn't work in this configuration, but I managed to get a sleep current of ~6.8uA

    SenseBender.png

    I can provide the binary output from the two IDE versions if someone can give me an indication where to find the build binaries.


  • Admin

    @tlund

    I think it's better if we can get the intermediate asm file from the compiler chain. Will look at it tomorrow evening (I have closed my computer down for the evening today)


 

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