Best posts made by Grubstake

@joedirt16
A lot depends on your background and how much of this is completely new to you. MySensors website assumes you have a certain level of knowledge and experience. To build something with MySensors you will need background in several broad areas:

1. Electronics hardware in general. Wiring together various electronic components. Selecting and buying parts and pieces. Soldering. Testing and troubleshooting.

2. Software/coding/programming. Much of what you will do with this is more about hooking together different existing software code, but usually some level of code writing to glue together the different pieces is needed.

If you have some experience & skills in either one of these two areas, you can probably learn what you need in the other one. If you don't have any experience in either of these areas, you will likely have a lot to learn before you will be able to build something you have in mind.

1. Specific platform knowledge. You need to know how to work with Arduino hardware and the IDE (development environment). You need to have a basic understanding of programming Arduino such as writing "C" language code.

2. Mechanical fabrication. You can do desktop prototyping without this, but to make a real-world device you need to be handy enough to put your electronics in an appropriate enclosure. Simple workshop fabrication, fasteners, adhesives, connectors, cables, etc.

Where to start:
There is a lot of information available for beginners. A starting point would be to focus on learning Arduino. It was designed for beginners. You will find a lot of beginner tutorials on the internet, one good place to check out is Adafruit. There are many others.

I would not start out focusing on MySensors. After you learn basics of Arduino and build some simple projects, it will still be quite challenging to jump directly to MySensors. MySensors is one part of a larger system - it lets you build sensor nodes but relies entirely on you having one of many separate Controllers to collect and work with that sensor data.

I have been building hobby electronics for many years, and it still took me many days of work to get my first MySensors device to operate and send data to a controller. (You need to get a working controller, too!)

I took this path, doing the easy work first and the hard stuff later:

1. Bought Raspberry Pi model 3, got it running.
2. Install "Domoticz" controller on Raspberry Pi. (Domoticz is I think one of the easiest controllers to get running and works well with MySensors).
3. Built "ESP Easy" sensor node on Adafruit Huzzah Feather hardware on a prototype board. ESP Easy does many of the things MySensors does, but with no programming. You will have to learn all about the Arduino IDE to do this, which is also required later with ESP Easy. ESP Easy does not require working with the radios that are central to MySensors, it uses small ESP8266 boards that use your wifi network instead. It's not better, just different and simpler.
4. With a working controller and a working sensor node, you have the minimum needed to add a MySensors sensor node. It's pretty much impossible to get MySensors running otherwise. Depending on your project you may not require the additional complexity of a radio based MySensors network.

Good Luck!

Tim

@ccy Look at the chart below "NRF24L01+ Radio". That shows the PIN numbers on the Pi and the pin labels on the radio to interconnect. Pay no attention to the labels on the RPi generic pinout diagram except the PIN numbers. The RPi SPIO labels are not what you are looking for. And be sure to use the chart for the correct RPi model.

@tbowmo said in Irrigation Controller (up to 16 valves with Shift Registers):

It seems that you have not read up on how mysensors works.. The purpose of mysensors is to create wireless sensors. To do this, we normally have a gateway connected to a computer running some kind of controller software.

Then we have sensor nodes that transmit (wireless) sensor data to the gateway which sends this to the controller software.

Again, please read up on how mysensors are designed, find more here https://www.mysensors.org/about

Hi Thomas,

You have hit on a point that I see over and over here, and that I shared with @tombstone for a long time before I was able to get a successful MySensors node working. (And I've worked with electronics and tech much of my life.)

Understanding the key components and how they fit together is essential for newcomers to MySensors, and is not very complex, but the information is widely scattered and completely missing from the the top level of the website. This discourages newcomers and creates endless questions on the forums as it is quite difficult to get anything working without many hours of reading and experimenting.

There is no obvious place on the website that explains the big picture as well as your last message! Newcomers to MySensors do not benefit from a clear simple picture of sensor nodes, gateways, and controllers and how they fit together.

• The Getting Started page does not mention controllers at all. And it's NOT as easy as 1, 2, 3!
• The Controller page does not describe the basic purpose of a controller, or how it connects to gateways and nodes. It's a useful advanced comparison of controller details, not beginner content.
• The Build page mentions some of the key components but again not how they fit together. (Nor is it about 'building'.)
• The Hardware doesn't really talk about the hardware.

(I'm sure there is much of this elsewhere on the website, but its not easy to find from the obvious links.)

It would be hugely helpful if Getting Started was an actual detailed overview of MySensors diagramming examples of complete end-to-end systems.

• sensor->arduino+radio node---->arduino+radio gateway->controller (Domoticz etc).
• sensor->gateware/node software->ESP8266 wifi->controller (no 'radio')
• etc.

Gateways are difficult to understand at the beginning as there are so many different ones and the Gateway names don't help...some are named by a single transport protocol (i.e. MQTT) some for an interface (Serial) some for a hardware platform (ESP8266), etc. I'm sure this seems obvious to lifelong engineers/developers but not so much for regular hobby geeks like many hobbyists.

I'm impressed with the work that has gone into MySensors and am grateful for all the hard work by the many developers and users who have contributed to it. I don't mean my comments to be a complaint. Presenting technical systems to often less technical newcomer/users is a challenging area. Improving the first impression of the big picture to newcomers would be a huge move forward.

Tim

@Osch Kind of hard to splice small gauge wires without soldering or terminals. A step towards wire splicing without soldering is to buy a wire stripper suitable for small ~20-28 gauge wires like this:

• Small wire nuts (probably the purple ones for 20-28 gauge or so). Requires wire stripper. Just cut jumper wires in half, strip, and twist up 3 or more for more grounds. Wire nuts make excellent connections, maybe use electrical tape to wrap them if there is any concern of tugging on the wires.

• No-strip insulation-displacement connectors aren't likely to work with the tiny stranded wire in your jumpers.

• Crimp splice connectors like used for telephone wire splices might work but then you need a decent crimper, although a pliers may do. May be too big for smaller wires.

• Screw terminal blocks can work well for wiring to sensors if you have a place to anchor the block.

Tim

@gohan I beat you to it!

I have been using Domoticz with MySensors nodes in several different configurations.

The closest I have done to what you are asking is to use the GatewayESP8266MQTTClient version, with one or more sensors connected directly to the ESP8266 running the above client software, so there is no separate Arduino. This is of course wifi only transport from the sensor node via the LAN to Domoticz controller, and it requires a MQTT broker (server).

Similarly I also use Domoticz with ESP8266 running ESPEasy which also transports by wifi, no Arduino. I strongly recommend this combination to get started as the only hardware is a ESP8266 like NodeMCU, Wemos Mini, etc. and your controller host (Linux computer or RPi), and the only software is Domoticz and ESPEasy, both of which require configuration but no customizing code. Of course you can as many sensor nodes as you like.

From reading on this site I got the impression that the ESP8266 is NOT an ideal choice for a general purpose MySensors gateway-to-LAN solution using radio-equipped Arduino sensor nodes, and the W5100 Ethernet Gateway is far better. But I am not using this myself.

Finally I also use MySensors with Arduino and attached radio link to a radio-equipped gateway on a RaspBerry Pi. This is a more complicated solution as you are now dealing with two radios, and both sensor node and gateway software you must configure/customize. It works well, however, and there is the opportunity to wire custom code at the sensor node if you require this.

If you do not have an existing working Domoticz or Mysensors installation, and you simply need data from common sensors, I strongly recommend trying Domoticz + ESPEasy. It is MUCH easier to set up and get running with supported software, as you simply install it on the ESP and configure via a webpage. It is a great help to learn Domoticz without too much complication.

Domoticz is a pretty easy package to get working compared to the others I looked at.

@peterrr
As a wet-behind-the-ears but reasonably successful novice with MySensors etc., I recommend first thing that you get something, anything, up and running that will cover the whole range of sensor->transport->controller working in a very simple way. This will dramatically help you figure out the parts and pieces. It can be very frustrating and time consuming getting your "hello world" first example of having sensor data appear on some device, as you really don't know which pieces are working and which aren't until you are there.

Specific suggestions:

Controller: Start with Domoticz as your controller. Vastly simpler than OpenHAB to get running, and surprisingly useful. Install it on a RPi connected to your LAN.

Sensor Node: If you have any practical use for wifi as the transport for some of your sensors (i.e. areas with wifi coverage) the simplest sensor/transport is ESP Easy on a ESP8266 such as WeMos Pro Mini or NodeMCU hardware, with any supported temperature sensor such as NRF24L01 or DHT22 (AM2302). These will talk over WiFi directly to Domoticz on a RPi. No code to write or modifiy with ESP Easy.

In a fraction of a day you can have a controller and working sensor up and running. Knowing your controller actually works is a much easier place to start from with MySensors radios etc.

Next steps: MySensors sensor nodes can be run on an ESP8266 client gateway without separate radios where Wifi is available, so you can get ahead on how MySensors code works out of the way before tackling radio hardware.

Finally, for long range/out of wifi scenarios, you can then start messing around with radio transport, which means you need sensors attached to one or many Arduinos which host one or more sensors. To get at the sensor data, you need a controller (Domoticz etc.) to receive the sensor data and make it available on your LAN with a web browser.

Domoticz is able to forward data to cool things like Grafana/InfluxDB or other dashboards for graphing, consolidating, presentation, etc.

None of these parts or pieces are too tough for someone with your background. But working on all of them at the same time is a pretty tough learning/debugging process.

Have fun,

Tim

@rozpruwacz
Late to this but for anyone who finds this thread (like I did) with the same thing in mind...here's a relay that looks like it might work for some. (I have not received it yet.)

https://www.ebay.com/p/5v-Flip-flop-Latch-Relay-Module-Bistable-Self-locking-Switch-Low-Trigger-Board/14005978712

Specifications:
Working voltage: DC 5V
Working current: 70MA
Standby current: 1UA
Load current: AC 250V / 10A, DC 30V / 10A
Trigger mode: Low pulse trigger

There are 10 more listings for what looks like the same product...most about $2 US.

This seems useful for any sort of battery powered node that is to trigger opening or closing a circuit. I certainly would not use it for house lighting in general due to the toggle/uncertain state, storing the state at the node, detecting the relay state when switching, and synchronizing to correct an error seems possible if needed.

My use case is to provide remote control to outdoor landscape lights that use AC line power and a transfer to feed low voltage lighting common in the USA. I have a large yard with 4 different transformers that currently mechanical timer, light sensor, or electrical timer. I'm usually happy to NOT automate dedicated independent simple systems that just work. In this case, my equipment needs fixing after a power outage (mechanical timer), doesn't work well in winter when photo sensors don't get enough light, and I can't turn on the lighting manually very easily. I want to keep these transformers in place as a fallback (in manual 'on' mode), so I could use remote controlled relay to switch the 12 volt AC output to the lighting circuit. I prefer to use battery powered nodes even though line power is available because everything is outdoors and weatherproofing an AC power supply to power a node might be more work.

@wallyllama

I have had good luck with 1 wire but only after careful attention to the wiring itself. Star topology can work fine for several sensors, but daisy chain is important for less trouble, as mentioned.

Wiring comments: wiring is the most important thing.

1. Use a twisted pair cable (or twist your single conductor wires). Cat5 or telephone wire or similar works well. Solder all connections in the daisy chains or use wire nuts or terminal blocks, or other connectors. Do not just hand twist.

2. Your ground and + wires to the sensors should be connected directly to the board terminal closest to the power supply. Don't use skinny jumper wires or connect to a different convenient spot on the board, or to some other ground or +5 device connected to the board. (Yes, all +5 and ground terminals are not 'the same' when it comes to analog circuits.)

3. Don't run the wires in a bundle or nearby other wiring.

4. A lower value pull-up resistor is easy to try and may help. Another trick is adding a 100 ohm resistor in series where the 1-wire signal line connects to the board. (Disconnect wire from board, connect resistor to board, connect wire to resistor.)

Tim

@adiculiniute
Of course commercial controllers from Rain Bird, Orbit, and others are only $90-150 that will do exactly what you are asking about. A dedicated device will always have fewer points of failure. You can build this as others are suggesting but it will take an investment of time and money, not the easiest solution.

I love building projects but usually stick to those that have functional benefits I can’t get with inexpensive commercial products. Your priorities may be different of course.

Tim

@peterrr said in I need advice with brainstorming my farm project:

So if this was your farm, what would you do?
Thus 11 Arduino projects currently and I would like to turn them into nodes. I have a Raspberry Pi to use that I can place of at any one of the Wifi AP's.

What functionality are you looking for when you say "turn them into nodes"? Receiving/logging data from multiple supported sensors for remote display is the simplest and a controller like Domoticz cat be a hub for many types whether DIY or commercial. Controlling remote switches/lights is fairly straightforward. Controlling custom built projects in an interactive way is not so easy. Having a remote node is not like having your Arduino plugged in to your computer (serial monitor, software updates). If you are trying to integrate monitoring and control of multiple devices the controller and its capabilities become the big issue.

My experience so far is mostly monitoring sensors and simple controllers (DIY thermostat/humidistat). RPi works fine but is somewhat fragile IMHO with write fatigue on the card storage. If you want something a lot faster and more robust an inexpensive headless desktop computer works well. I got up to speed on a single RPi 3 running domoticz, with a MySensors radio gateway, InfluxDB and Grafana. Once I found it would work I moved it to an Intel NUC computer with SSD storage running Ubuntu Server. Way faster and easy to back up on my LAN.

If you are a software developer type itching to learn a complex system for maximum flexibility OpenHAB has a good reputation (and steep learning curve). If you want to get get something working quickly and get your bearings Domoticz is a lot closer to plug and play, who knows it may suit your needs.

I like to try to find the simplest/fastest way to get the job done as I'd rather be using this stuff rather than fussing around under the hood all the time...I already have other hobbies.

@iancu said in Battery powered latching relay node:

The last part would be to have it run in smartSleep and wake up when state change request is sent by gateway (as far as I read this is not possible).

As Electric pointed out, when it is sleeping the radio is turned off and it's not possible to listen for communication. How quickly do you need to be changing the relay state? Unless you can be sleeping almost all the time, you may have a problem. If you can wake up for a second or two every 5 or 15 minutes and check, that's much different than if you need to respond to a light switch within one second. You need to know how much power is used while sleeping, then how much is used to wake and check if a change is needed, then go back to sleep. Do the math based on how often you need to be checking.

@peterrr said in I need advice with brainstorming my farm project:

The whole farm is pretty much covered with Wifi but I would have liked to keep the nodes -> gateway off our wifi, and only use the wifi for the controller...

I felt the same and monkeyed around with radios for quite a while. (I have a much smaller place, 3 buildings, good wifi everywhere.) Then I tested out the ESPEasy on ESP8266 sensor nodes and it was so straightforward that I haven't gotten past some prototype radio nodes. As has been said you can mix wifi and radio nodes to a single controller. Are you sure more devices on your wifi will create even the slightest problem and you aren't making it more complicated than needed for a good reason?

Many of my sensor nodes run a handful of sensors on a single ESP8266 (no Arduino needed, but runs code via Arduino IDE), the hardware couldn't be simpler. In this scenario with MySensors nodes the sensor node IS the gateway...no fussing with radios outside the builtin wifi.

Do you consider the amplified (and slightly optimised) NRF24L01s sufficient for the node network? Or RFM69HW?

I messed a lot with the NRF radios and for the most part the market is full of dirt cheap clones mostly with counterfeit chips and the consistency and reliability is all over the map. Some radios work OK, but a huge pain sorting them out The RFM radios do not appear to suffer from this problem and I suggest starting with them.

Tim

@stevanov

Hi,

I'm no MySensors guru to be sure. You started by saying you were considering a second Controller. Then mentioned two Gateways.

You didn't mention what particular Controller you are using now. I've been using Domoticz for my Controller for a couple of years. Domoticz is perfectly happy to talk to multiple Gateways. I have some sensors on a MySensors radio network exposed to Domoticz through a single Mysensors Gateway. I also expose multiple ESP8266 (wifi) sensor nodes, each of which Domoticz sees as a separate Mysensors Gateway. I also have several virtual gateways collecting online data from Netatmo sensors and other online sources.

You can certainly have more than one MySensors (radio) gateway if they are on different radio types (and I believe different channels). The concern is that Mysensors radio nodes must communicate exclusively with a single Mysensors radio gateway. You can't have a gateway wander around into the area covered by another gateway unless its on a different frequency, or routing may get all mixed up. It doesn't work like Wifi or cellular where connections are handed off.

Your sensors won't get exposed to Controllers at all. Just one gateway for any node and multiple Gateways should be OK...at least for Domoticz.

Hope I got that all right.

Cheers!