💬 Battery Powered Sensors

[giovaFr]

I think i've finnaly understood :
1.1V is not a reference like an offset it is a reference as a max readable voltage
Analog Input will always return values between 0 and 1023
5V / 1023 bits = 0.0048 V per bit
1.1V /1023 bits = 0.001075 V per bit
so with 1.1V we are allmost 5 times more accurate. Moreover it seems that 1.1V will stay stable even if battery voltage becomes low. (so understand now why using it)
And that's what mfalkvidd explained : if we type in code : analogReference(INTERNAL); then voltage must never exceed 1.1V on A0 (it is different on an arduino Mega)

Now to choose R1 and R2 here what i've made :
A0maxV = VbattMax * (R2 / (R1+R2)
for me it means
1.1V = 8.4V * (R2 / (10^6 Ohms + R2)
so i use R2 around 150k Ohms

A0voltage = A0value * 0.001075
A0Voltage = VBatt * (R2 /(R1+R2))
A0Voltage = VBatt * rRatio
VBatt = A0Voltage / rRatio = (A0Value *0.001075 ) /rRatio

So here the magic formula:
VBatt = (A0Value *0.001075 ) /rRatio

Let me know if i'm wrong somewhere.

[tonnerre33]

@giovaFr said in 💬 Battery Powered Sensors:

A0maxV = VbattMax * (R1 / (R1+R2)

Are you sure about that ? I think is A0maxV = VbattMax * (R2 / (R1+R2)

R2 = 150k Ohms for 8.4V with R1 always at 1M Ohms

[giovaFr]

oops you are right i mixed both :)

i fixed my error, thanks

[Efflon]

If I power my 3.3V miniPro through VCC, do I still need to remove/cut the voltage regulator?
I thought the current moved from vvc-in/raw through the regulator and then to the MCU and VCC :confused: .
My battery powered nodes are dying and I suspect I need to change BOD and eventually something more (LED gone )..

[GertSanders]

@Efflon

VCC pin is directly connected to the MCU.

The RAW or IN pin is connected to the regulator input. Th eregulator output is connected to VCC pin and thus to the MCU power input pin.

On a 3V3 promini you can give between 3V3 and 12V (on most promini's, some can handle up to 16V) on the RAW or IN pin. The regulator on the promini will bring that down to 3V3 (which you will be able to measure on the VCC pin).

By giving 3V3 on the VCC pin, some power is lost via the output pin of the regulator (through the regulator) towards the GND pin of the regulator. This should be minimal, but on bad regulators it can be enough to drain a battery in weeks. So yes, I would cut the regulator output line when giving power via VCC.

Cutting the line of the powerLED (on either side of it, doesn't matter) will make sure that the LED does not drain the battery either. This LED can pull between 5 -15mA depending on the protection resistor that sits in series with it.

So VCC pin and RAW pin are NOT the same.

[Efflon]

@GertSanders Thanks for you explanation. I thought vvc on the short end next to rx was going through the voltage regulator just as RAW. Anyhow I have already de-soldered the LED's and are powering through vcc next to A3. Apparently my voltage regulators are bad so I'll cut the lines and give it a try and hope power consumption stays low.

[maghac]

I've used the Vcc library to read the battery level without voltage divider or any other external components. Is this not a reliable way to measure?

[maghac]

I'll answer myself - no, the Vcc lib is not realiable :) I had a sensor that died yesterday and it reported 100% battery until the end...

[AWI]

@maghac The Vcc library is reliable. It uses the internal 1.1 v reference of the MCU to measure the voltage on the Vcc pin. If your sensor keeps reporting 100% I guess you either power the arduino through a regulator (or the raw pin) or missed something in the Vcc initialisation/ calibration.

[maghac]

@AWI It's possible that I missed something in the code. I am powering the arduino directly on VCC though and I'm not using a regulator.

Will have another look tonight.

[aclertant]

Do you think that the use of a piezo electric switch is possible ?
I found one that deliver 24v and 0,2A... The goal would be to create wireless switch...

[AWI]

@aclertant Interesting idea... Energy harvesting with piezo-electric components is certainly possible. From MySensors point of view the energy (very very little) has to be stored and boosted to power the radio and mcu for message processing. There are a few examples of "harvesting" remotes (i.e. Philips HUE) but I am not sure if these use a piezo element.

[hiddenuser]

I removed the both the LED and the Voltage Regulator of an Arduino pro min 3.3v . The simple sketch on it's own works fine. However when I connect an NRF24L01 it does not communicate back to the gateway.. :(

[gohan]

@aclertant
If you look at enocean products there are already commercial energy harversting switches in case you don't find a way to make it.

[aclertant]

@gohan yes it's exactly what I'd like to do ;)

I should forget to use an arduino in fact... just send one command using... a pic ? or something else...

The enocean switch is really cool, but quiet expensive :(

[gohan]

Like all commercial products they cost because they have been developed, tested and produced. So it's up to you if you want to spend time tinkering or go with an already working solution :-)

[aclertant]

@gohan @AWI
we need something like this but for NRF24L01 module.
https://github.com/SmingHub/Sming
Do you think that possibly exist or there is a huge problem ? Like no eeprom or something like that ?

[gohan]

You see, enocean protocol has been developed from the start to be used with devices that use energy harvesting, so you can't think to use general purpose HW (like esp8266, FRF24, Arduino boards) that is not optimized very low power consumption (look at all the mods required to make a mini pro last months on battery with a reed switch and a nrf24 module); with piezo-electric components the amount of energy is really really tiny so you need super optimized HW to work with that.
The link you posted is about something that works on a ESP8266 but that works over wifi, that is for sure not the best energy efficient system.

[napo7]

There is a much more efficient way (and cost-less) to measure VBATT :
https://provideyourown.com/2012/secret-arduino-voltmeter-measure-battery-voltage/
It doesn't need any external resistor, so there will be no current flowing even when the Atmega is asleep.

[AWI]

@napo7 This has been mentioned in this topic. @Yveaux Vcc library is the easiest way to handle this.