NRF24L01+PA+LNA power consumption

[Mark Swift]

I'm using these modules, I presume the base unit is compatible? I was confused when I read above that the PA modules may need a 3v control line.

http://www.icstation.com/22dbm-100mw-nrf24l01ppalna-wireless-transmission-module-p-4677.html

I'm really frustrated that none of my modules work unless I physically hold them, even the shielded ones above!

[AWI]

@Mark-Swift High frequency transmission is a kind of dark science... ;-) I had the same experience you had with the 'expensive' shileded modules. The best performance upto now I have with my own shielding on the PA modules (plastic and aluminum tape/foil) powered by the adapter board and connected to a stable 5v supply.

[Oitzu]

@Mark-Swift and @AWI i never worked with the adapter board, but doesn't shift the adapter board also the signal levels down?

@Mark-Swift need to hold the module is often a sign for non solid shielding or the shield is not grounded.
Out of courosity what power supply are you using in front of the adapter board?

[Mark Swift]

@Oitzu I presume the shielded modules from IC station would be spot on with regards shielding?

Right now I have my base module connected the 5v line of my Uno...?

[AWI]

@Oitzu nothing fancy on the adapter board other than a LDO and decoupling (and a LED).

be aware that the schematic is for the 10p version of the nRf24

[Oitzu]

@Mark-Swift well.. maybe you should give the module a little bit more current. :)
I don't know which regulator the Uno uses but i would assume that it don't deliver enough current.

About the grounding.. better be sure, take your multimeter and check if the shielding has continuity to GND.

@AWI ah okay... well.. i'm still unsure if and which modules need the lower 3.3V level on CE.
It just happens that i only use 3.3V arduinos.. and the raspberry pi, which also has 3.3V logic.

[parachutesj]

@Mark-Swift
I received two of them a few days ago and both work very well. I soldered a cap onto it as suggested and pointing the antenna straight up (aligned with Z axis)
One is just powered by an original Uno and the other via liniar power regulator. Not saying that this is enough, just in my case it is stable since Friday (3-4 days)

[Mark Swift]

@parachutesj

Strange, how are you driving them, what volt control line, 5v?

[AWI]

@Mark-Swift The ones you refer are shielded.. as far as I can see.

So next level in debugging... how is you ground connected,. You can try to power the adapter plate from the supply of your UNO. The on board LM1117 should be able to accept upto 20V.

[parachutesj]

@Mark-Swift
no 3.3V.
However as said, it is an original Uno. I have clones which deliver no clean or reliable signal. I measured it before but don't remember exactly but was quite off.

[Mark Swift]

@parachutesj said:

@Mark-Swift
no 3.3V.
However as said, it is an original Uno. I have clones which deliver no clean or reliable signal. I measured it before but don't remember exactly but was quite off.

The Uno has 5v control lines doesn't it?

[parachutesj]

@Mark-Swift
the digital ports? AFAIK yes.
the radio VCC is connected to 3.3 (all to the pins as in the tutorial GND, VCC 3.3, D9-D13)
The other setup is via external power (ipad USB-Adapter) to a breadboard, VIN directly from 5V to the Arduino and another line via 3.3V regulator to the NRF24 radio. all other lines again directly connected to the arduino.

[Mark Swift]

@AWI Ground is connected from the baseboard back to the Uno, along with the VCC. That's how I'm currently powering it, 5V from uno into the adaptor plate. All other control lines directly into the Uno.

[Oitzu]

hackaday caught wind on the tinfoil method.
http://hackaday.com/2016/05/31/fixing-the-terrible-range-of-your-cheap-nrf24l01-palna-module/
Maybe there also some points hidden in the comments that would help?

[Mark Swift]

I saw this on Hackaday, could we make this change in MySensors?

"Don’t use polling over SPI to check if there is a received packet like most of the libs out there do. This increases the noise. Use the IRQ pin"

@hek

[hek]

In the development branch we do use irq nowadays, if you define

#define MY_RF24_IRQ_PIN xx

It also de-queues messages from the NRF24 quickly, which reduces missed messages.

[Mark Swift]

@hek amazing, I never knew that.

So all I would do is define this line in my sketch and connect up the IRQ line?

I presume I can use this on both my gateway (ESP8266) and my nodes (Nano / Uno)?

[hek]

The ESP still doesn't support this feature due to lack of SPI transaction support (if I remember correctly? @Yveaux ).

[Yveaux]

@hek @Mark-Swift More precisely, it misses the interrupt protection for SPI transfers. Ref https://github.com/esp8266/Arduino/issues/1943.

But the queueing is not yet in development, as far as I know -- it is in my personan testing branch https://github.com/Yveaux/Arduino/tree/development_rxqueue

[Oitzu]

@Mark-Swift there are basicly effects that could occur while you holding the module:
1.) You are forming a very small capacitor between you and the module.
Much unlikely to be the reason.
2.) You are functioning as an antenna for the module.
Also much unlikely, you would probably bring more noise then signal in the system.
3.) You function as a shield to the module.
More likely. I got the same behavior with insufficient shielding.
The shielding works ungrounded in low noise environment but needs to be grounded in a high noise environment.
This happens, as example, if a insufficient shielded switching power supply is nearby.

Please make absolutely sure that your shield is properly grounded!