Is ARM the future of MySensors?
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So is anyone thinking they will use the encryption features on a normal Arduino? Or is it, as I was thinking, that if you want to use encryption you'll have to upgrade?
@alowhum if you only enable encryption (not signing) you can fit more into an atmga328p. Also, if you use a rfm69 radio, encryption is hw backed, so it require less flash space (thus potentially allow you to also fit signing).
Furthermore, using a atsha204a means signing also take less of flash since some of the algorithms are hw backed. -
Well, regarding the OP, I think I read somewhere that development would largely move to ARM, and that at some point it would stop on the atmega. Not sure that I'm recalling it correctly though. Is it true?
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@anticimex: interesting.
This is my use case: all I want is that I put a password at the top of all my arduino files, and then my neighbours won't be able to receive my data because they don't have the password. That's encryption, right? At the moment anyone can pick up the values that my sensors are sending out into the city. And that's kinda creepy.
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@anticimex: interesting.
This is my use case: all I want is that I put a password at the top of all my arduino files, and then my neighbours won't be able to receive my data because they don't have the password. That's encryption, right? At the moment anyone can pick up the values that my sensors are sending out into the city. And that's kinda creepy.
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@anticimex: interesting.
This is my use case: all I want is that I put a password at the top of all my arduino files, and then my neighbours won't be able to receive my data because they don't have the password. That's encryption, right? At the moment anyone can pick up the values that my sensors are sending out into the city. And that's kinda creepy.
@alowhum the simple password option is the simplest way of enabling security. At the same time it is the most expensive as it does not require personalization and therefore is pure software based (except for rfm69 encryption). So you need to trade simplicity for code size.
That said, once you have figured out personalization (and there is plenty documentation on the matter) it can easily be repeated, as long as you keep the sketch used to program the personalization data. -
@anticimex: interesting.
This is my use case: all I want is that I put a password at the top of all my arduino files, and then my neighbours won't be able to receive my data because they don't have the password. That's encryption, right? At the moment anyone can pick up the values that my sensors are sending out into the city. And that's kinda creepy.
@alowhum also, the simple password option enable both signing and encryption so it takes up a lot of memory. If encryption is the only thing you want, just personalize the devices with an AES key and enable encryption only. It is not that good (fixed iv) and easily crackable by someone who has an idea about AES but it at least obfuscate your messages fairly well. Combined with signing it is better, but, again, that costs memory.
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@alowhum the simple password option is the simplest way of enabling security. At the same time it is the most expensive as it does not require personalization and therefore is pure software based (except for rfm69 encryption). So you need to trade simplicity for code size.
That said, once you have figured out personalization (and there is plenty documentation on the matter) it can easily be repeated, as long as you keep the sketch used to program the personalization data.@anticimex Hmm, I didn't realise that. Could it be an idea to create a MY_ENCRYPTION_SIMPLE_PASSWD feature as well, without the signing? Would that fit the "opportunistic curious neighbour" scenario?
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@anticimex Hmm, I didn't realise that. Could it be an idea to create a MY_ENCRYPTION_SIMPLE_PASSWD feature as well, without the signing? Would that fit the "opportunistic curious neighbour" scenario?
@alowhum give personalization a shot. Since you use the simple flag, you are already on the development branch, so you have a simplified personalization flow. It is documented in doxygen (see the pinned signing post for a link)
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@alowhum I bet there are hundreds of people interested in your house temperature :sweat_smile:
Btw, yes that is encryption@gohan said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
@alowhum I bet there are hundreds of people interested in your house temperature :sweat_smile:
Btw, yes that is encryptionActually, just my temperature would already indicate
- Whether I am home or not. "He'll never know we took the jewelry".
- if I go on holidays a lot. "How is he paying for all that".
- Whether I am feeling ill (set it a bit higher). "Got a fever last week? Or did your grandma visit"?
- If I am environmentally conscious. Something I don't want to talk about at the neighbourhood BBQ..
- Etc.
Now add to that my other sensors.
Now add to that all the actuators (yikes!). -
@davidzh said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
But in Urban areas with lots of high rises the 2.4GHz band is a bit congested.
That's my case , there are 350 appartments in my building alone and my nrf24 network runs well, while my old 433MHz system regularly miss messages, that's why it will soon be replaced.
@nca78 said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
there are 350 appartments in my building alone and my nrf24 network runs well
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi, is it not being disturbed by other wifi networks? (I guess that in 350 apartments there are a minimum of 350 wifi networks).
I never quite understood how exactly nrf24 and wifi go along.C: OpenHAB2 with node-red on linux laptop
GW: Arduino Nano - W5100 Ethernet, Nrf24l01+ 2,4Ghz mqtt
GW: Arduino Mega, RFLink 433Mhz -
@nca78 said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
there are 350 appartments in my building alone and my nrf24 network runs well
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi, is it not being disturbed by other wifi networks? (I guess that in 350 apartments there are a minimum of 350 wifi networks).
I never quite understood how exactly nrf24 and wifi go along.@dakipro said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi, is it not being disturbed by other wifi networks? (I guess that in 350 apartments there are a minimum of 350 wifi networks).
I never quite understood how exactly nrf24 and wifi go along.It depends on the channels used by NRF24 and wifi networks, so far I've been lucky it seems :)
Also, high rise is in fact probably helping by having thick concrete walls with lots of rebars inside, attenuating radio signals. I see many networks but most of them have week signal. -
@nca78 said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
there are 350 appartments in my building alone and my nrf24 network runs well
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi, is it not being disturbed by other wifi networks? (I guess that in 350 apartments there are a minimum of 350 wifi networks).
I never quite understood how exactly nrf24 and wifi go along. -
@nca78 said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
there are 350 appartments in my building alone and my nrf24 network runs well
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi, is it not being disturbed by other wifi networks? (I guess that in 350 apartments there are a minimum of 350 wifi networks).
I never quite understood how exactly nrf24 and wifi go along. -
The current NRF24 set up is more secure than bluetooth or wifi from attack.
I say this based on the fact that anyone with a laptop, mobile etc can have software to crack/hack/spoof/inject into bluetooth or wifi. It is not that difficult for kids to do.
The NRF is another matter as to achieve this on that radio module would require acquiring a module, setting it up with a pc/phone and then getting software to attack it.
People often go the easiest route and I am less worried about nrf24 than I would be if the system used bluetooth/wifi or cloud.
Just my thoughts on a dark and wet Monday morning.....
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@dakipro said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi
The frequency band of nrf24 is wider than used by wifi. If you select a frequency just outside the wifi band it should help in reducing interference.
@yveaux said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
@dakipro said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi
The frequency band of nrf24 is wider than used by wifi. If you select a frequency just outside the wifi band it should help in reducing interference.
Thanks, that is what I thought. Btw, I am using default channel for mysensors (79 or whatnot), is that "just outside" enough?
I never had (connection) problems with mysensors, so I never researched fine-tuning options.Can some android wifi analyzer help with the showing what is best to use, is there some guide available regarding nrf24? (should we write a guide? :) )
C: OpenHAB2 with node-red on linux laptop
GW: Arduino Nano - W5100 Ethernet, Nrf24l01+ 2,4Ghz mqtt
GW: Arduino Mega, RFLink 433Mhz -
@yveaux said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
@dakipro said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi
The frequency band of nrf24 is wider than used by wifi. If you select a frequency just outside the wifi band it should help in reducing interference.
Thanks, that is what I thought. Btw, I am using default channel for mysensors (79 or whatnot), is that "just outside" enough?
I never had (connection) problems with mysensors, so I never researched fine-tuning options.Can some android wifi analyzer help with the showing what is best to use, is there some guide available regarding nrf24? (should we write a guide? :) )
@dakipro said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
I am using default channel for mysensors (79 or whatnot), is that "just outside" enough?
I don't believe so. Channel 123 is though. Easy to remember.
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@yveaux said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
@dakipro said in Is ARM the future of MySensors?:
If nrf24 working on same/similar frequency as wifi
The frequency band of nrf24 is wider than used by wifi. If you select a frequency just outside the wifi band it should help in reducing interference.
Thanks, that is what I thought. Btw, I am using default channel for mysensors (79 or whatnot), is that "just outside" enough?
I never had (connection) problems with mysensors, so I never researched fine-tuning options.Can some android wifi analyzer help with the showing what is best to use, is there some guide available regarding nrf24? (should we write a guide? :) )
@dakipro see here for a mapping of wifi and nrf24 channels: https://forum.mysensors.org/topic/4721/nrf-frequency-and-channels/5
NRF24 Channels 2..96 overlap with wifi. I personally would stay away from the high nrf24 channels (110+) as I've seen troublesome performance with clones.
Channel 100 performs well at my place.
