NRF24L01+PA+LNA distance problem

[yd kim]

Hi All,

My project has 1 gateway + 5 node with temperature sensor and it is installed in orchard.
All node is within 20meter from gateway but seems there are a lot of packet loss.
I bought module from aliexpress which is mysensors link (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1sets-Special-promotions-1100-meter-long-distance-NRF24L01-PA-LNA-wireless-modules-with-antenna/32341792715.html)

Communication was fine in the office but when I install in the orchard it loose some data.

I did try a lot of things on the web.
Here is the list I have been try to solve the problem but no luck yet.

1. 800mA 3.3V LDO saperate Power to the module
2. 2x 10uF LDO in/out
3. 100UF Al Cap, 2x 10UF ceramic Capacitor on base board
4. 100uF , 2x 10uf On the module
5. warp the module with tinfoil
6. bigger antenna ( a little bit improved)
7. 3M corded antenaa ( no difference)
8. change mysensors config to MY_RF24_PA_LEVEL RF24_PA_MAX ( no difference)

Is there any other option?
It's really strange, the module specification is 1km but even not working properly within 20meter..
I don't think there is interference because it is installed rural area..

Sorry for bad English;;

[fleinze]

I had some issues with pa+lna modules. The solution was a better ground connection.

[flopp]

When it was in your office, was it 20 meters distance?
Try another nRF+PA+LNA
What kind of nRF does the nodes have?

[yd kim]

@fleinze
Thank you for your reply. Can you share how to make better ground connection?
I made tinfoil wrap on the module and connect gold antenna connector.

[fleinze]

@yd-kim In my case I added an extra wire-connection fromm the 5V-side of the LDO-module to the 3.3V-side.

[yd kim]

@flopp
Well I guess it was 10-15meter in the office.
Also when I check the orchard on google, it probably 25-35meter. Sorry for making confusion.

I used first 5 node + 1 gateway and it was same distance issue so I made another 5 node and 1 gateway with more capacitor but same distance problem.

The title on aliexpress is "1100-meter long-distance NRF24L01+PA+LNA wireless modules"

Sorry I put correct link. The link is the product what I bought from aliexpres.

[flopp]

@yd-kim
Do you have nRF+LNA+PA on gateway?
Do you have nRF+LNA+PA on nodes?

[yd kim]

@fleinze
Thank you for your quick response. Well I use custom PCB which has plenty of GND area on the board.
Anyway will keep think how to make better ground for the module.

[yd kim]

@flopp
I use nRF+LNA+PA on both.

[flopp]

@yd-kim
Check that you have correct antenna.
I was using female antenna and the nRF was also female which resulted in very bad connection.
Nodes are not battery powered?

[MiKa]

Also check with RF scanner if its not a "jamming" from other RF device, or simply try to change channel to different one.

[yd kim]

@flopp
At the first time I use default antenna but it was same issue so I bought exactly same long antenna. It make a little bit better but not perfect..
I knew what you are talking about. It wasn't normal so a little bit expensive compare to normal wifi antenna.

Thank for your concern.

[yd kim]

@flopp

Whole system is Li-Ion battery powered system with solar.
Gateway has 3S2P Li-Ion battery with proper solar panel. Battery voltage never go under 11V.
Node has 1x18650 Li-Ion battery with small solar panel.
Node goes sleep mode for 10 minutes then wake up and send data within 10 second.

[yd kim]

@MiKa
Device is installed in rural area. There is only one wifi. I don't think there is jamming or interference..
I don't have RF scanner. If I couldn't find any other solution , probably I need to build RF scanner to check it..

[mfalkvidd]

@yd-kim https://www.mysensors.org/controller/sniffer might be an easy way if you want to scan.

[fleinze]

Sometimes we get shitty modules from china:
https://forum.mysensors.org/topic/1153/we-are-mostly-using-fake-nrf24l01-s-but-worse-fakes-are-emerging
I made good experiance with these rather expensive ones:
https://de.aliexpress.com/item/2pcs-RF2401F20-2-4G-high-integrated-RF-module-with-Nordic-s-RF-chip-nRF24L01-For-Free/32302870943.html
But even with these I had to be very careful about antenna placement

[MiKa]

Another RF scanner with mini OLED 0.96 display
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?2777178-Very-cheap-Arduino-based-2-4-GHz-band-monitor

[flopp]

@yd-kim said:

@flopp

Whole system is Li-Ion battery powered system with solar.
Gateway has 3S2P Li-Ion battery with proper solar panel. Battery voltage never go under 11V.
Node has 1x18650 Li-Ion battery with small solar panel.
Node goes sleep mode for 10 minutes then wake up and send data within 10 second.

What kind of Arduino do you use?

[yd kim]

@flopp
Gateway : ESP8266 ( use 3A switching step down power module)
Node : Arduino pro mini 3V ( Arduino use battery power directly and nRF24L01 use 3.3V LDO 800mA one with 0.3V drop down )

[gloob]

Why don't you connect the NRF also directly to the battery?

[yd kim]

@gloob
nRF module should not use over 3.6V and Li-Ion battery is 4.2V when it is full charged.

[flopp]

Quick fix may be to add resend if Failed.

See here

https://forum.mysensors.org/topic/3355/count-car-starts/19

[gloob]

@yd-kim said:

@gloob
nRF module should not use over 3.6V and Li-Ion battery is 4.2V when it is full charged.

I thought you are also powering the Arduino directly from the battery over the 3.3V pin.

[yd kim]

@fleinze

I keep reading the article.. interesting
The module which on the link is too expensive for my project;;

[yd kim]

@gloob
Arduino doesn't matter up to 5V so I don't mind for arduino.
If I feed same power to arduino, I need bigger LDO and also less efficiency.